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Thread: NSGP Online Championship 7

  1. #766
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Reeves View Post
    I'll throw another idea into the "Race Control" debate - how about a "retired" driver take on that role? Seeing as the timings of the races plus lag+damage=racefail for me in the Championship, I'll happily nominate to be the Race Control official. It's not a good idea for a driver in the Championship to be a steward, as they have a vested interest in the result and could (rightly) be claimed to be biased. Me, I'll just look at both replays and call out that Prz was doing his best Lewis Hamilton impersonation again....

    I like this
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  2. #767
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Reeves View Post
    I'll throw another idea into the "Race Control" debate - how about a "retired" driver take on that role? Seeing as the timings of the races plus lag+damage=racefail for me in the Championship, I'll happily nominate to be the Race Control official. It's not a good idea for a driver in the Championship to be a steward, as they have a vested interest in the result and could (rightly) be claimed to be biased. Me, I'll just look at both replays and call out that Prz was doing his best Lewis Hamilton impersonation again....
    Ohh yes. Perfect solution, methinks. Though it's sad you can't race with us...


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  3. #768
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    I like the idea of a neutral person to take care of that department even if i would like a more active person on the forums to do that. But im fine....
    Also, the race control is not to exist only with with 1 person. We have to nominate 2 more. 3 i guess is the perfect number.


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  4. #769
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso View Post
    I like the idea of a neutral person to take care of that department even if i would like a more active person on the forums to do that. But im fine....
    Also, the race control is not to exist only with with 1 person. We have to nominate 2 more. 3 i guess is the perfect number.
    I'm still lurking - just that my experience with lag and damage was so bad and unrealistic that it tells me that that particular set of rules makes it impossible for me to play, and would impact others as well. Coupled with the decisions made about race times which exclude me from half the Championship, there was really no point in trying to participate.

    I'm very keen to get involved with 1.30, and have said that I'd really like to do what I can to help the problems with Net code - I'm the worst case scenario for latency... I would have loved to have assisted with the Beta (have experience with software beta-testing in my real world life), but it seems that closed shop was with others. I'm still around, just geography and timezones mean I'm not here when most of the rest of you are...

    Why do you need 2-3 people for race control? That just sounds like more of a recipe for conflict. Like I said, happy to make the offer, but if you've got a grand plan, so be it.

  5. #770
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    Because 1 person does not work What am I to do if one person thinks I'm guilty and I think I'm not? It's his vote against mine... if there are 3 then at least 2 or 3 ppl have to think you're guilty. It's a very good filter for decision making as you have extra eyes to see the injustice and extra hearts to sympathize with people involved

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    Guys, i haven't slept in about 50 hours ... going to sleep now, will update sheet when i wake up!

  7. #772
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    Because 1 person does not work What am I to do if one person thinks I'm guilty and I think I'm not? It's his vote against mine... if there are 3 then at least 2 or 3 ppl have to think you're guilty. It's a very good filter for decision making as you have extra eyes to see the injustice and extra hearts to sympathize with people involved
    Kos's got a point there. Having three officials to establish guilt of suspects would be ideal... the question is, who those three persons should be ? I think we can easily exclude Kolowski and Kos as those two are usually involved in ambiguous situations and are title contenders which renders them untrustworthy. I really don't like the idea of both Kos' and Kolowski's method. It's simply idiotic. Boll ocks to that! What has place in the previous season to do with honesty, trustworthiness and other virtues a good referee should posses? Nothing. The choice should be democratic... I say 'Power to the people!'

    If it comes to Afonso the situation is quite different. First of all, he is a winner by default... the title is already his so we can hardly say he is a title contender Moreover, the bloke's so fast that he hardly ever gets involved in fights with other drivers Well, the last statement is possibly a wee bit far-fetched but there is a grain of truth in it. I've never heard anyone complaining about Afonso's behaviour on the track. He is simply a good egg, he is. Now, having Alex and Afonso we need one more person... I've been pondering on that for some time and, to me, the only solution is Paul Mellor. Those three; Alex, Afonso and Mellor would make a great team An honest and genuine not fast and furious... Anyways, that's just my opinion and you don't have to agree with it. I'm not saying that those three must be elected and that's the only solution. I think that the three stewards should be elected by democratic vote not race count or position in the last season... that's just utter nonsense. Cheers!


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  8. #773
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Reeves View Post
    I'll throw another idea into the "Race Control" debate - how about a "retired" driver take on that role? Seeing as the timings of the races plus lag+damage=racefail for me in the Championship, I'll happily nominate to be the Race Control official. It's not a good idea for a driver in the Championship to be a steward, as they have a vested interest in the result and could (rightly) be claimed to be biased. Me, I'll just look at both replays and call out that Prz was doing his best Lewis Hamilton impersonation again....
    That's a nice sample of being unbiased...

    Precisely because the stewards would be biased, I will vote against the race control. I think in real F1 the race control is there to enforce safety and avoid the destruction derby. If cars were a bit more resistant and there was no safety risk, I think they would allow much more aggressive driving. In NSGP there are no lives at risk and one bad collission does not end the race, so for me this whole race control idea is just an attempt to help those who can't handle collissions well...
    NSGP Online Championship

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    Quote Originally Posted by KingKong View Post
    What has place in the previous season to do with honesty, trustworthiness and other virtues a good referee should posses? Nothing. The choice should be democratic... I say 'Power to the people!'
    I hardly think any of us would want to do such a thing in a dishonest way, besides we cannot measure any of those qualities on a standardized test or we would, and we'd chose more relevant qualities as well. The "most active players" method makes sure referees have a max possible chance of being present and dealing with the situation quickly and it kinda rewards players for being active as well. Democracy is sadly just an utopian idea that never works, not offline, not online. Online voting always favors popular people first, then likeable people, then don't-rock-the-boat people, etc, in that order From what I've seen so far if you happen to be the perfect person for the job you may jump over a more popular person and gain a higher place, but almost never 2 and 3...


    I've never heard anyone complaining about Afonso's behaviour on the track. He is simply a good egg, he is. Now, having Alex and Afonso we need one more person... I've been pondering on that for some time and, to me, the only solution is Paul Mellor. Those three; Alex, Afonso and Mellor would make a great team An honest and genuine not fast and furious...
    Haha... see? You've fallen into a trap already! What Afonso is is what I've been talking up there - likeable! But we're also talking about a guy who should've won by a few victories more than me last season and instead has won with 15-1 in victories (or smth) because of his "fast" driving style! (and by fast I mean that list where he is 3rd behind Chang and Kolowski ). Paul Mellor is a good don't-rock-the-boater but I'm afraid Reeves would never pass as non-furious? Hell he's always been the most furious guy here, which had impact on his judgement a couple of times as well

    edit: prz, I believe Alex was kidding there

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    LOL To all comments here lately!

    I vote for democracy being Utopic or not. So, in the end of Season 7 we should have a normal voting procedure....between many other options there will be Race control YES or NO.
    If Yes, then every guy who makes part of the the official championship or wants to make part of it, should choose 3 names trying to be as fair as possible and not just cause you get along better with this or with that one.

    @Marek Dont put me where im not! Cmon, im just a guy who like this kind of games that´s it and in what i do in my life i try to make it good instead of many stuff and average results.

    And now not trying to make campaign....i think Mellor would be a nice candidate as he is an expresident! Also Santamaria but....i think there shouldnt be accumulated roles for the same person (Like Berlusconi being president of Milan and depute ). Or president or Race Control! Frost would be another possibility. About me doing also the job, i wouldnt mind even though i would like to have access to all replays anyway so i can make my own conclusions. I think that should go to a separate thread with the links for the replays of all players who feel like sharing. Anyway, that we can speak/decide later...
    Have a great weekend guys and see you tomorrow for Brasil.....and at night the only race i dont have in my CV Abu Dahbi! All my efforts will go to that race!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    I hardly think any of us would want to do such a thing in a dishonest way, besides we cannot measure any of those qualities on a standardized test or we would, and we'd chose more relevant qualities as well.
    I'm not saying that you guys are evil or anythynig of that sort That was not my intention. What I'm driving at is that you may see certain facts as they are not... you may, completely subconsiously, twist them to suit your point of view . I'm actually quite surprised that you said that... that non of you would use the power for your own benefits. Have you forgotten what happened a week ago ? How you were forced to drive on Przemo's server ? I remember you bitching about it... that it was dishonest etc. What's the actual truth I don't know and it is not for my to judge. I hope you see my point now. In my opinion a person elected for steward should be, well maybe not completely cause that's simply impossible, but as neutral as possible... and with all due respect but you and Kolo are not. How would you feel if Przemo were to judge wether you are to be punished or not in a situation in which you are 2 points ahead of him ? I'm quite positive that you would scream outloud how unfair that is and how he's trying to prevent you from getting the title. And vice versa. I'm sure you don't want that You are a bit of a bigot... but I guess that you could call me one too We all stick to our ideas I gues...


    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    Online voting always favors popular people first, then likeable people, then don't-rock-the-boat people, etc, in that order From what I've seen so far if you happen to be the perfect person for the job you may jump over a more popular person and gain a higher place, but almost never 2 and 3...
    As far as I know you live in a democratic country... would you like to change it ? I know that I'm diverting from the main topic of our conversation a bit and you may ask yourself "what the heck has that to do with NSGP" You say that the most popular person wins... that happens only if the electorate is stupid enough to make such choices. I believe that we are all people of reason and can think for ourselves. I believe that I've presented in my previous post a logical stream of thoughts showing why I would choose Afonso and Alex over you and Prz. Of course you say that I would vote for Afonso because he is a "likeable" person but as usualy you either intentionally change the meaning of my comments or you just don't understand it. Both options are quite plausible. See the next paragraph.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    Haha... see? You've fallen into a trap already! What Afonso is is what I've been talking up there - likeable! But we're also talking about a guy who should've won by a few victories more than me last season and instead has won with 15-1 in victories (or smth) because of his "fast" driving style! (and by fast I mean that list where he is 3rd behind Chang and Kolowski ). Paul Mellor is a good don't-rock-the-boater but I'm afraid Reeves would never pass as non-furious? Hell he's always been the most furious guy here, which had impact on his judgement a couple of times as well
    Haha... I love the way you take one sentence out of the context and twist it to fit your theory If you have read what I wrote you would see that my main argument is that Afonso does not have to actually compete with any of you because every season he wins the title before the championship is finished... 2nd and 3rd best driver in NSGP is not able to compete with him. The pressure is on you and Przemo... not Afonso. As to furiousness of Alex... what's the difference now that he is not an active player ?

    Please be a grown man and if you decide to respond to my posts, refer to all relevant points, not only those that are easy to tackle for you.


    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  12. #777
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso View Post
    @Marek Dont put me where im not! Cmon, im just a guy who like this kind of games that´s it and in what i do in my life i try to make it good instead of many stuff and average results.
    Just to make sure... I'm not sucking up to you or anything of that sort I just lay the facts as they are


    "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts."

  13. #778
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alfonso View Post
    I vote for democracy being Utopic or not. So, in the end of Season 7 we should have a normal voting procedure....between many other options there will be Race control YES or NO.
    If Yes, then every guy who makes part of the the official championship or wants to make part of it, should choose 3 names trying to be as fair as possible and not just cause you get along better with this or with that one.
    Nope. You can have as much faith in people as you want but it will never work and I won't have part of it. We need a fair decision of the likes suggested but that does not involve popularity.


    Quote Originally Posted by KingKong View Post
    I'm not saying that you guys are evil or anythynig of that sort That was not my intention. What I'm driving at is that you may see certain facts as they are not... you may, completely subconsiously, twist them to suit your point of view . I'm actually quite surprised that you said that... that non of you would use the power for your own benefits. Have you forgotten what happened a week ago ? How you were forced to drive on Przemo's server ? I remember you bitching about it... that it was dishonest etc. What's the actual truth I don't know and it is not for my to judge. I hope you see my point now.
    I think Przemator considers his acts within the boundaries of the game? I mean, I think he's an ******* but I wouldn't say he's "wrong" in those exact words. That has nothing to do with his capability to do the right thing if the circumstances ask for it, which I'm quite sure he's capable of. Come on, it would be insane to put him down because I'm not overly fond of him...


    In my opinion a person elected for steward should be, well maybe not completely cause that's simply impossible, but as neutral as possible... and with all due respect but you and Kolo are not. How would you feel if Przemo were to judge wether you are to be punished or not in a situation in which you are 2 points ahead of him ? I'm quite positive that you would scream outloud how unfair that is and how he's trying to prevent you from getting the title. And vice versa. I'm sure you don't want that You are a bit of a bigot... but I guess that you could call me one too We all stick to our ideas I gues...
    I don't know... can you elaborate? I've always took pride in the neutrality of my actions (not my behaviour ). I've been a voluntary punching bag for years on track and... I've never called kids names! j/k Fonzie, you know I'm just teasing a bit, right!?
    Seriously, though, I'd feel weird if any one person was a judge but with 3... I'd have to be really hard into conspiracy theories to believe they would all go against their better judgement, and in front of the other judges too, just to set me up.


    As far as I know you live in a democratic country... would you like to change it ? I know that I'm diverting from the main topic of our conversation a bit and you may ask yourself "what the heck has that to do with NSGP" You say that the most popular person wins... that happens only if the electorate is stupid enough to make such choices. I believe that we are all people of reason and can think for ourselves.
    Rly? Well, I'm not gonna claim how I know all about world democracies... but from what I've seen so far your quality as a candidate has very little to do with your success in democracies. It all comes down to what kind of backing you got, in form of $$$ injected into your campaign from the interest groups you would represent if elected and political powers behind your back. For example, every election in croatia you maybe get a glimpse of someone with ideas, someone with sound logic and smarts that exceed your own. I say a glimpse because those people can only get occasional sympathy and you get to see the same morons over and over again fighting it out. The less developed a country/population is, the bigger ridicules you're forced to watch, sad really.



    I believe that I've presented in my previous post a logical stream of thoughts showing why I would choose Afonso and Alex over you and Prz. Of course you say that I would vote for Afonso because he is a "likeable" person but as usualy you either intentionally change the meaning of my comments or you just don't understand it. Both options are quite plausible. See the next paragraph.
    nah... I just think it's your dislike of me and prz taking over your mind on a subconscious level The Afonso argument does not stand for me and the Reeves part... well... you know. Your own words of what qualities a referee should have would disqualify him.


    Haha... I love the way you take one sentence out of the context and twist it to fit your theory If you have read what I wrote you would see that my main argument is that Afonso does not have to actually compete with any of you because every season he wins the title before the championship is finished... 2nd and 3rd best driver in NSGP is not able to compete with him. The pressure is on you and Przemo... not Afonso. As to furiousness of Alex... what's the difference now that he is not an active player ?
    Maybe Afonso would not win the title if he wasn't in the judges as well The difference is he just showed up and already from his post you could imagine him punishing Prz because he feels like it

  14. #779
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    .....The Afonso argument does not stand for me and the Reeves part... well... you know. Your own words of what qualities a referee should have would disqualify him....

    Maybe Afonso would not win the title if he wasn't in the judges as well The difference is he just showed up and already from his post you could imagine him punishing Prz because he feels like it
    OMG, i even get an argument with my own name!!?? I feel honored about it!
    I see Afonso everywhere....WTF did i do? I havent almost posted about it... lolololol
    Yeah, true i did call names to a kid in the chat!!! I feel guilty and should be punished for that Mr KOS! Teaser.....

    BTW...this conversation its starting to be worth it to go to offtopic thread!
    Last edited by Alfonso; 11-25-2011 at 10:43 PM.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    Nope. You can have as much faith in people as you want but it will never work and I won't have part of it. We need a fair decision of the likes suggested but that does not involve popularity.
    Wait wait wait... who the hell are you to say 'nope' to this? As far as I know your not the boss here so I guess we will have democracy if we want it. I will go facking Lech Walesa on you arse if it's necessary to achieve democracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    I think Przemator considers his acts within the boundaries of the game? I mean, I think he's an ******* but I wouldn't say he's "wrong" in those exact words. That has nothing to do with his capability to do the right thing if the circumstances ask for it, which I'm quite sure he's capable of. Come on, it would be insane to put him down because I'm not overly fond of him...
    I don't get it... if he was not wrong why did you give him an earful the other week ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    I don't know... can you elaborate? I've always took pride in the neutrality of my actions (not my behaviour ). I've been a voluntary punching bag for years on track and... I've never called kids names! j/k Fonzie, you know I'm just teasing a bit, right!?
    Seriously, though, I'd feel weird if any one person was a judge but with 3... I'd have to be really hard into conspiracy theories to believe they would all go against their better judgement, and in front of the other judges too, just to set me up.
    Well the way I see it is that your neutrality is determined by the position you are in so to speak... not by your actions. You know how president or prime minister is not allowed to run their own companies? That's analogus. The mere existance of the possibility that you could use your 'powers' for your own benefits makes you a bad candidate. Of course IMO. Actually when I think of it I haven't seen you doing anything out of the way on the track... but that's probably because I'm usually faaaar behind you during the race Anyways, your not the person I will vote for.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    Rly? Well, I'm not gonna claim how I know all about world democracies... but from what I've seen so far your quality as a candidate has very little to do with your success in democracies. It all comes down to what kind of backing you got, in form of $$$ injected into your campaign from the interest groups you would represent if elected and political powers behind your back. (...) The less developed a country/population is, the bigger ridicules you're forced to watch, sad really.
    Ok, now, what in the name of sweet baby Jesus are you talking about ? Is money involved in NSGP ? NO. Do we have media showing us false image of reality ? NO. Do candidates for stewards need people 'behind their backs' to win ? NO. What have you been snorting today ? I don't understand this hatrade towards democracy... as far as I know we elect new president every season via democratic voting and I've never heard you complaining about that. Maybe my idea doesn't appeal to you because I strongly oppose to the idea of you being in the "control" ? Maybe that's subconscious too ? But again you missed the most important bit. I generally agree with you that all those presidential campaigns and whatnot are indeed conducted in such a way to deceive the electorat showing only unimportant aspects of politics and hiding the essence but that works only for those imbeciles who are unable to think for themselves. Above all THIS IS NOT REALITY. IT'S A COMPUTER GAME No one's going to play such games here Kos... (political games of course )

    Quote Originally Posted by Sida79 View Post
    nah... I just think it's your dislike of me and prz taking over your mind on a subconscious level The Afonso argument does not stand for me and the Reeves part... well... you know. Your own words of what qualities a referee should have would disqualify him.
    First of all I don't dislike Przemo, he is a good egg. You on the other hand... I don't know you so how can I like you or by the same token despise you, huh? As to Alex, maybe your right I really don't know the guy.


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